1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Help GSX250 1981 Only one spark - Ignition Coil?

Discussion in 'Suzuki 250cc Twins' started by Realmellow, May 26, 2020.

  1. Realmellow

    Realmellow Active Member

    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    173
    Joined:
    May 23, 2020
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    England
    My Bike:
    1981 Suzuki GSX 250
    Hi all. It's my first post but I'm sure won't be my last as have a GSX250 bobber project on the go.

    Long story short, the bike wiring was a total mess. Twisted wires together then covered with tape running all through it. I've decided to strip it out and rewire it properly but before I do I want to get it ticking over so I took out old electrics and wired in a basic running circuit.

    After pressing the start button the starter motor kicks in but engine doesnt fire up. I took the spark out and tested them only to find I'm only getting a good spark on the RH plug. Checked the LH plug but no spark. Stuck the working RH spark plug into the LH HT leads but no spark. This makes me think it's a bad coil? The resistance of the primary winding is fine on both coils but the resistance of the secondary winding for both coils is around 17k ohms when the manual says 23-25k.

    I would love to know any thoughts or further tests I can do to resolve the spark problem. Any help would be greatly appreciated!
     
  2. GreyImport

    GreyImport Administrator Staff Member The Chief Contributing Member

    Messages:
    10,929
    Likes Received:
    6,720
    Trophy Points:
    1,168
    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2012
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Between a Rock and a Hard Place
    Location:
    North by NW NSW Oztralia - Tamworth
    My Bike:
    *Kawasaki ZXR250C *Yamaha FZR250R 3LN1 *Yamaha FZR400 *Triumph Bonneville 750 T140V *Triumph Daytona 675 *Triumph Tiger 800XC
  3. Realmellow

    Realmellow Active Member

    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    173
    Joined:
    May 23, 2020
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    England
    My Bike:
    1981 Suzuki GSX 250
    • Like Like x 1
  4. GreyImport

    GreyImport Administrator Staff Member The Chief Contributing Member

    Messages:
    10,929
    Likes Received:
    6,720
    Trophy Points:
    1,168
    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2012
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Between a Rock and a Hard Place
    Location:
    North by NW NSW Oztralia - Tamworth
    My Bike:
    *Kawasaki ZXR250C *Yamaha FZR250R 3LN1 *Yamaha FZR400 *Triumph Bonneville 750 T140V *Triumph Daytona 675 *Triumph Tiger 800XC
  5. Murdo

    Murdo The Good Doctor Staff Member Contributing Member Ride and Events Crew

    Messages:
    6,400
    Likes Received:
    4,788
    Trophy Points:
    1,148
    Joined:
    May 4, 2013
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Tamworth, NSW
    My Bike:
    1937 Royal Enfield 250, CF Moto 250 V5, Honda's XL250, CBR250, FT500 plus a few others.
    Is the left hand coil getting power? What happens if you swap coils, does it still only fire on the right or only on the left then?
     
  6. Realmellow

    Realmellow Active Member

    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    173
    Joined:
    May 23, 2020
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    England
    My Bike:
    1981 Suzuki GSX 250
    Awesome, will check them out!

    I can't do any checks until Friday but I did check before and know that both coils are getting power. One thing I did notice was when I checked the volts through the spark plug caps, one had a constant 12v-ish reading (the one that doesn't spark) and then press the start button it actually drops in volts whereas the working side has a very small/if any reading and then when I press the start button the volts jump way up, as I would have expected. Thoughts?

    I appreciate the input so far!
     
    • Like Like x 1
  7. Realmellow

    Realmellow Active Member

    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    173
    Joined:
    May 23, 2020
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    England
    My Bike:
    1981 Suzuki GSX 250
    Will swap coils over and see what that does. Will post update once I have tried that.
     
  8. my67xr

    my67xr Bike Enthusiast Staff Member Premium Member Contributing Member

    Messages:
    4,313
    Likes Received:
    2,383
    Trophy Points:
    898
    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2016
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Panel Beater, Spray Painter, Custom Fabricator
    Location:
    Adelaide, South Australia
    My Bike:
    Yamaha's , 1990 FZR250R 3LN3 , 1986 XT250TS 57R , 1984 IT200L 43G, 1976 IT400C 510
    Post up some picture's of the frame and harness where the coil's mount etc etc,
    have you checked that it isn't a simple problem like having the coil and horn wire's mixed up?
     
  9. Realmellow

    Realmellow Active Member

    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    173
    Joined:
    May 23, 2020
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    England
    My Bike:
    1981 Suzuki GSX 250
    Okay so first go back at the bike today. Swapped the coils over and boom, the coil that worked now doesn't and the one that didn't work now does, which means the coils work so it's the wiring further back (thanks for that suggestion!). After a little testing with a multimeter I've ended up back at the Ignition Control Unit, and more specifically the B/Y wire that feeds into it from the coil. Weirdly I'm getting a 4.94v reading from the B/Y coming out the Ignition Control Unit whereas the White wire (the other one that feeds into the other coil and works) is coming back as 0v - I assume that being what it should be unless I hit the start button.

    Am I dealing with a faulty Ignition Control Unit or does the issue go back to the signal generator? Any checks I can do?

    Thanks again so far!
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2020
  10. ruckusman

    ruckusman White Mans Magic Master Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

    Messages:
    3,230
    Likes Received:
    1,420
    Trophy Points:
    918
    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2013
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Narrabeen, NSW Australia
    My Bike:
    Yamaha FZR250 3LN1
    If you can open the ignition control unit you'll likely find the transistor(s) and perhaps affiliated components to be replaced

    Although I suspect the main ignition transistor as long as everything isn't buried in epoxy
     
  11. Realmellow

    Realmellow Active Member

    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    173
    Joined:
    May 23, 2020
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    England
    My Bike:
    1981 Suzuki GSX 250
    Thanks ruckusman. Just to clarify you're thinking is the issue lies with the the main ignition transistor? Are those replaceable/repairable?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  12. ruckusman

    ruckusman White Mans Magic Master Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

    Messages:
    3,230
    Likes Received:
    1,420
    Trophy Points:
    918
    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2013
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Narrabeen, NSW Australia
    My Bike:
    Yamaha FZR250 3LN1
    I don't know the particular ignition box obviously, but when it's all taken into account, if you can open the box AND it isn't potted in epoxy then the process of replacing the actual transistor is a 30 minute job from there, at most

    If you look at this post @my67xr has done a great job of drawing the schematic with the important components shown - the two 2SD2141 are the ignition transistors on the FZR250 and lots of other yamahas

    Your box will be similar, i.e. two transistors for the ignition - one of those have failed and any actually shows signs of burning or overheating

    OK great thread on your exact issue

    https://2fiftycc.com/index.php?threads/gsx-250-ignitor-help.9091/

    This post shows the box open - and if you look at the open box - second last photo
    https://2fiftycc.com/index.php?threads/gsx-250-ignitor-help.9091/#post-95334
    The two transistors are vertical on the sides between the aluminium strap above the plug

    First step would be to open the box and let us know what you see
     
    • Like Like x 1
  13. Realmellow

    Realmellow Active Member

    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    173
    Joined:
    May 23, 2020
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    England
    My Bike:
    1981 Suzuki GSX 250
    Unfortunately, my unit is epoxy backed so it will be a hard time getting into it. There is a youtube video detailing how to get into one by using heat to work it off but looks quite messy! I'll see if it's feasible first, else I'll be looking at trying to source a second-hand unit I think.

    I noticed on the thread you shared that @Brendengra mentioned that both the 32900-44410 & 32900-47020 units are possibly compatible with the gsx250 - is there any way of confirming this please? My current unit is labeled as 32900-47026 with a 1984 date so obviously isn't the original unit for my bike but means units around that year seem to be compatible, I have attached a photo.

    As always, thanks for the help so far everyone :drinks:
     

    Attached Files:

  14. my67xr

    my67xr Bike Enthusiast Staff Member Premium Member Contributing Member

    Messages:
    4,313
    Likes Received:
    2,383
    Trophy Points:
    898
    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2016
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Panel Beater, Spray Painter, Custom Fabricator
    Location:
    Adelaide, South Australia
    My Bike:
    Yamaha's , 1990 FZR250R 3LN3 , 1986 XT250TS 57R , 1984 IT200L 43G, 1976 IT400C 510
    The original Ignitor unit 32900-44410-000 is NLA from Suzuki, but there is a replacement part available for it 32900-43402-000
    Not sure how compatible the 1984 Ignitor is with your bike

    There's a new old stock 1981 GSX250E Ignitor unit for sale on ebay, but be prepared to pay big for it ! -
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/32900-4340...252859&hash=item4d70ebbe92:g:1ckAAOSwTqtd4O1p




    Carmo Electronic's can pull your's apart and rebuild it, not sure on cost's involved
    https://www.carmoelectronics.com.au/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=497_663_2258_2839

    They also have an improved brand new replacement Ignitor available for your bike
    https://www.carmoelectronics.com.au/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=2159



    You might be able to find a local person that can take your Ignitor apart and repair/refurbish it too
     
    • Like Like x 2
  15. ruckusman

    ruckusman White Mans Magic Master Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

    Messages:
    3,230
    Likes Received:
    1,420
    Trophy Points:
    918
    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2013
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Narrabeen, NSW Australia
    My Bike:
    Yamaha FZR250 3LN1
    See how you progress with a little heat in loosening things up with a view to disassembly, if you're lucky all of the components aren't drenched in it, from there if you can find old skool electronics repair place the rest should easy, but of course it depends on the first part
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. Realmellow

    Realmellow Active Member

    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    173
    Joined:
    May 23, 2020
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    England
    My Bike:
    1981 Suzuki GSX 250
    I had a go at the Ignitor box but it was caked in Epoxy and a nightmare to try and get apart (without breaking it). I've checked out Carmos unit as well as trying to source a second-hand unit but coming up pretty pricey, which is when I came across a company called Boyer Bransden. They sell digital ignition systems for GSX250s as well as a bunch of other bikes for a decent price (£139) with a 5 year guarantee (http://www.boyerbransden.com/microdigitalmicropower.html). It actually just arrived so will fit today and let you know how it goes. Anyone else had any experience with these?
     
  17. maelstrom

    maelstrom LiteTek Staff Member Premium Member 250cc Vendor Contributing Member

    Messages:
    5,108
    Likes Received:
    3,477
    Trophy Points:
    1,148
    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2012
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Thailand
    Home Page:
    My Bike:
    Yamaha FZR400 3TJ1, Honda MC22
    Only about 44 years ago, but they worked then. :)
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
  18. GreyImport

    GreyImport Administrator Staff Member The Chief Contributing Member

    Messages:
    10,929
    Likes Received:
    6,720
    Trophy Points:
    1,168
    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2012
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Between a Rock and a Hard Place
    Location:
    North by NW NSW Oztralia - Tamworth
    My Bike:
    *Kawasaki ZXR250C *Yamaha FZR250R 3LN1 *Yamaha FZR400 *Triumph Bonneville 750 T140V *Triumph Daytona 675 *Triumph Tiger 800XC
    Yep Boyer Bransdens are probably fitted to every old British bike still on the road .... including my Triumph :thumb_ups:


    Boyer Brandson (Small).png
     
    • Like Like x 1
  19. Realmellow

    Realmellow Active Member

    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    173
    Joined:
    May 23, 2020
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    England
    My Bike:
    1981 Suzuki GSX 250
    Ahh, they've been around a while then. Good to know!

    Fitted it today and sparks on both plugs, happy days!! Just gotta refit carb I cleaned yesterday and fingers crossed the thing fires up. I'll then need to set the ignition timing properly, will give this forum a search for any threads on the subject - however, I do have the workshop manual.

    Appreciate all the help up until now guys
     
    • Like Like x 4
    • Winner Winner x 1
  20. Realmellow

    Realmellow Active Member

    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    173
    Joined:
    May 23, 2020
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    England
    My Bike:
    1981 Suzuki GSX 250
    Update: Put everything back together but still not getting the bike to start.

    I'm getting strong spark on both new plugs, the carbs have been cleaned, the timing has been set. I turned the engine over with a little easy start into air intake bit still nothing which means it's not necessarily a carb issue. The battery was fully charged. Have ordered a compression kit to test the cylinders as it's the only thing I can think left to check.

    Looking for any other suggestions? Bit of a head scratcher to be honest.. I was pretty confident it'd fire up.
     

Share This Page