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Help MC22 Odd Idle Problem I'm clueless

Discussion in 'Maintenance' started by Damus, May 19, 2016.

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  1. Damus

    Damus She is a BEAST and riding it is comparable to sex Dirty Wheel Club

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    My normal go to people aren't responding but maybe someone has had this issue or can point me in the right direction.
    I've recently been doing a lot of work on my bike and I mean allot but since the other night when I was fixing another problem I decided I was going to put my serious face on and do thinks fully precision.
    Work done the other night before problem started:
    -new oem spec plugs with nkg stock gap of 0.9mm I made sure I tuned them in exactly to the nkg installation guide.
    -Ignition coil rebuild checked and made sure resistances were the same between the 2 coils buy snipping lead lengths and cleaning contacts and caps with electrical contact cleaner.
    -perfectly cleaned carb boots and then coated the outsides with a perfect layer of shoe glue using a brush.
    -Checked carb sync was 100% with my bench sync method of using guitar string
    -tightened exhaust headers really well
    -used precision felt tip pen and perfectly set pilot screws EXACTLY to manual setting from seated like 100% that I am sure of.
    -used a little nulon engine cleaner to help clean out what should be by now carbon ash deposits that isnt a problem anymore anyway so lets not go into that.
    -fully charged my new battery
    -got oil height of my full synth 100% on the line of dip stick
    -made 100% certain ALL hoses all lines all everything was perfectly sealed and couldn't leak
    -put carbs back on the bike so perfect u dont understand, i never spend much time pushing them on but this time I made sure all 4 were perfect and exactly same tightness inside diameter exactly the same in a circle as the tubes they connect to fully in line.

    I set my idle speed to the books 1.5k and after all that hard work my idle is broken, it sounds like a broken valve or something like its lost its normal half second dun dun dun dun dun dun which admittedly did go hunting every 12 duns for a bit but now its this quick jaring stabby D D D D D D D D D D D D D D like someone is tapping your head 4-6 times a second and louder than before.
    It doesn't go hunting and is evenly spaced at least but I cant think for the life of me where I went wrong. Like one day before the work normal car sounding dun dun dun dun dun dun. Now is this crazy fast loud even stabbing D D D D D D D D D D Ive never heard anything like it and have never read anything about an idle changing like that, there is nothing in the manual.
    Weirdly enough I have been working on other intake mods and got my mixture perfect from loads of work and the sound of my engine when its going is crisp and snappy and I when its going its a complete animal weapon that sounds like it could beat anything right to red line. But now whenever I pull up at lights etc the stupid D D D D D D D D D D D D D starts and then eveyone starts looking like something special or interesting has happened to their day. And I am thinking YES I KNOW I STUFFED UP I WILL FIX IT!!!
    I am positive of my work so the problem must be elsewhere id think has anyone else ever had this idle issue? I think I need a rebuild =( even though it makes no sense im getting so much power when its going, like im pretty sure the bike is the fastest its ever been so I dont get it. HELP!!!
     
    Damus, May 19, 2016
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  2. Damus

    Damus She is a BEAST and riding it is comparable to sex Dirty Wheel Club

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    never mind delete thread. I know what they mean about idle speed now when referring to setting mixture screws. bloody confusing that is.
     
    Damus, May 20, 2016
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  3. Tim_

    Tim_ resident nutcase Contributing Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    Just a side note here, But I recommend (now this is just me) a semi synthetic oil because your bike uses friction plates in the clutch so it helps with the clutch not slipping, the slight oil build up on the moving parts in the engine help with wear and tear. Fully synth oil actually wears your engine internal parts out fast because there is not the build up... Now Im not saying massive amounts of build up are good but slight is.... If you know what I mean.... I know many people have their own opinions but this is what I have found out from mechanics on who work with newer bikes they said "synth is good for less millage and wears parts out faster sso you come back sooner, basically a money grab"... but that is me and my opinion..
     
    Tim_, May 20, 2016
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  4. kiffsta

    kiffsta Senior Member

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    can you post a vid ?
     
    kiffsta, May 20, 2016
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  5. Mclaren

    Mclaren Well-Known Member Contributing Member

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    Hang on shoe glue on carbs? U plan on ever taking them off????
     
    Mclaren, May 20, 2016
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  6. kiffsta

    kiffsta Senior Member

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    nah, think laterally....... its for increasing traction :thumb_ups:

    He used it to seal them in case there was cracks
     
    kiffsta, May 20, 2016
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  7. Mclaren

    Mclaren Well-Known Member Contributing Member

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    Lol I can see a post 6 months on "why are these boots stuck on"
     
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    Mclaren, May 23, 2016
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  8. Damus

    Damus She is a BEAST and riding it is comparable to sex Dirty Wheel Club

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    Sorry for late vid, yeah here's how my performance idle sounds haha. After allot of tuning last night (electrical and carb syncing/mixture/plugs/etc etc). It was very cold around 8 degrees so without a choke it was fairly hard to get fired up.
    But I tell you what when it warms up lookout, the bike goes warp speed Scotty.
     
    Damus, May 30, 2016
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  9. Joker

    Joker See "about me" for contact details. Contributing Member

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    Can you kill the background music mate? Makes it hard to hear the bike...
     
    Joker, May 30, 2016
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  10. Damus

    Damus She is a BEAST and riding it is comparable to sex Dirty Wheel Club

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    Yeah will do
     
    Damus, May 30, 2016
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  11. Damus

    Damus She is a BEAST and riding it is comparable to sex Dirty Wheel Club

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    The much less enjoyable no music version lol
     
    Damus, May 30, 2016
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  12. Joker

    Joker See "about me" for contact details. Contributing Member

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    Had a good listen with earphones... it's always hard to diagnose something by distance but I'd probably look at compression ie valve clearances... Why I think that is:

    1. There's a very faint "tick" or a "clicking" noise you can hear, in particular towards the end of the video. A phone sometimes distorts noises but it sounds familiar to what I had on my FZR, and the clearances needed to be done.
    2. The fact your bike seems that hard to start, even cold, indicates compression may be on the lower side - especially if you've looked at other things like spark & fuel etc (ie spark-fuel-compression are your "big three" items for any machine).
    3. The ramping up and down could be compression differences across cylinders until the bike gets warm.
    4. The last thing is when you say when warm the bike runs sweet. When the bike is warm you'll get metal expansion that can affect compression (ie improve it) hence it can mask the underlying issue.

    If it's not smoking it's probably not rings but I heard clearances are relatively easy on a CBR... Kiffsta would know more.

    Hope that helps, just my 2c.
     
    Joker, May 30, 2016
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  13. Damus

    Damus She is a BEAST and riding it is comparable to sex Dirty Wheel Club

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    Theoretically I can't disagree with any of those points but I do have questions related to those points.
    1. Faint ticking of the valves is a good thing isn't it? A slight noise in the valve train is a good train?
    2. Hard to start even cold, well I mean there was no choke use at all and I did just have the carbs off right before with the float bowls completely empty and it was quite cold outside, surely others would have similar problems starting?
    3. I would have thought the increase in revs as it warms would have more to do with the mixture slowly getting richer as the air temperature heats up, the down was me just turning the idle speed screw down to set the idle.
    4. Again I feel it is running more sweet as it heats up due to the fuel to air being more correct once it heats up because its set lean to account for it heating up. Compression may increase due to expansion also but before I mess with the valves I think a good step prior might be to do a compression test.
     
    Damus, May 30, 2016
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  14. Joker

    Joker See "about me" for contact details. Contributing Member

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    1. I can't give a blanket answer for that because I don't know. All bikes make noise, distinct ticking is usually valves. Is it a good tick or a bad tick? dunno. On mine when i did clearances I couldn't hear any ticking at all anymore...
    2. Mine starts without choke easier than that even when cold. And mine's a finnicky FZR.
    3. Don't know as can't see what you're doing. Last time I had a ramping car it was the head gasket heh
    4. Yes, doing a compression test is the way to go. If it's low I'd be looking at valves (sorry if i wasn't that clear).

    One other thing I thought of was that there are many adjustments you can make on a bike which can have a flow on affect by hindering or helping other issues. For example, richening the mixture will compensate for a loss of compression to an extent because you're counteracting the leaning affect... if that makes sense. The fact you've set your bike up perfectly from a spark/fuel perspective may mean your previous settings were masking other issues and now they have surfaced.

    That's usually why they say "one thing at a time" otherwise you'll change 10 things and not know what affected what etc. But of the "big three" the compression is the most logical thing to check... could be wrong but I'm a logical thinker heh
     
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    Joker, May 30, 2016
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  15. Mclaren

    Mclaren Well-Known Member Contributing Member

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    Should be no ticking from valves
     
    Mclaren, May 31, 2016
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  16. Damus

    Damus She is a BEAST and riding it is comparable to sex Dirty Wheel Club

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    I have to know... Where do you get your information?
    There is no substitute for checking properly with feeler gauges, but I'm sure if you read about you will find that your supposed to be able to hear your valves.
     
    Damus, May 31, 2016
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  17. KICKERMAN360

    KICKERMAN360 Well-Known Member

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    You're supposed to hear the valve train in terms of like... overall noise. But usually there shouldn't be a noticeable ticking noise, especially not on an inline engine which a normally quite quiet in terms of engine noise/rattles. I can't hear a ticking noise on my 600RR (except when I just start it up, although I think the oil has something to do with that) but I can a little on the 250RR. Of course the fool-proof option is to go 2 stroke and never deal with head-valves again!
     
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    KICKERMAN360, May 31, 2016
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  18. Mclaren

    Mclaren Well-Known Member Contributing Member

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    Experience mate had a few of them all been mechanically a1 and yes u u can hear the engine making its standard noise but ticking it doesn't
     
    Mclaren, Jun 7, 2016
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  19. Damus

    Damus She is a BEAST and riding it is comparable to sex Dirty Wheel Club

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    here is a 2 old sample of my current engine sound, define the ticking?

     
    Damus, Jun 7, 2016
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  20. kiffsta

    kiffsta Senior Member

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    there is a ever so slight rattle there
     
    kiffsta, Jun 7, 2016
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