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So, 250cc Riders...

Discussion in 'The Pub' started by Joker, Apr 2, 2015.

  1. Joker

    Joker See "about me" for contact details. Contributing Member

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    Ride whatever you want. I don't care, if you're happy you're happy. You don't have to justify yourself to me.

    Just don't go saying bigger bike riders are "lazy", "less skilled" or any variant of that because they choose to ride a bigger machine. It's incorrect, misinformed, out of context and in some cases arrogant.

    Skill is the transferring factor, so the focus shouldn't be on which bike is better.

    As for me, I've been riding long enough to know a bigger bike is what I will be happy with long term. My FZR does not have some magical untapped power that I haven't discovered yet.
     
  2. Mclaren

    Mclaren Well-Known Member Contributing Member

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    No way are u lazy riding a bigger bike I can't imagine hanging onto a 600 racer atm the shear strength to hold on at top warp speed is tiring enough let alone braking cornering etc but a 250 is were u cut ur skills in braking cornering speed like I said I will step up a class when I'm ready but a lot to learn from the humble 250!!!!
    Think stu was more on the line of ppl selling them saying that 250 can't be beaten by a bigger bike which isn't true it's all on skill and bike set up but a top 250 rider will run circles on a 25 year inline around a fresh guy on a litre bike
     
  3. mboddy

    mboddy Well-Known Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    Stu. I don't give a rats about what people think about the bikes I ride.
    But this is the 250cc Forum and you asked what we thought about our 250cc bikes.

    I have over 40 years on bikes, owned dozens of them, started racing in 1972 and have been racing with PCRA for 20 years now.
    I honestly believe that 250cc is the best capacity for a bike.

    Over the years I could have gotten any bike I wanted to.
    But I regret not getting a V Twin TZ250 rather than not getting an OWO1 or RC30.

    I was going fast on my FZR1000 EXUP and expected to be taking trophies shortly but decided that crashing a 200+ kg projectile at over 200kmh can easily kill you. I saw Scott cartwheel his 250 at about 200kmh. He trashed the bike but didn't break himself.

    High corner speed bikes are fun!
    Get out on a track to really have fun, and better still go racing.
     
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  4. Mclaren

    Mclaren Well-Known Member Contributing Member

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    Up vote for racing mark
     
  5. Joker

    Joker See "about me" for contact details. Contributing Member

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    Anything going at over 200 km/h will probably kill you if you crash. I don't think the size of the bike is a mitigating factor there!

    @mboddy the purpose of this thread wasn't to try and get anyone to defend their choice(s). It was only to understand why some 250 riders have this condescending attitude towards those who ride bigger machines.

    I may go racing again one day, must admit tearing around Bathurst on my old 750 was quite thrilling...
     
  6. kiffsta

    kiffsta Senior Member

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    Hey Stu

    I haven't seen much on the forum here with us passionate 250c owners talking up our bikes as being better than larger bikes, however I do know what you mean about seeing some of the older in-line 4's advertised for sale with statements such, as

    smokes 600's in the hills
    embarrasses liter bike owners through corners.


    What I am seeing more and more is cb250, fzr250, gsx250, zxr250 owners talking up power figures of their bikes because the newer 250 range are well down on power in comparison

    my 2c
     
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  7. mboddy

    mboddy Well-Known Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    No worries Stu. I just love my 250s.
     
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  8. Revolver

    Revolver Big Member Premium Member

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    A little :offtopic:, but just explain this one to me Stu.

    A little bit contradictory there. To hone your skills, you need to ride the smaller bike on the edge consistently. Hence:

    But you want to upgrade before you have really learnt the bike? And yourself?:idk::idk::idk:

    I think what most people who own a 250 mean by those statements is that Bigger bikes (including 600's) their abilities are SO immense is that you never really get to experience what they are. And if you do, it may mean loss of licence, unless its on the track.

    I think the other thing they are saying is, its much like the feel of speed. 500kmh in a go kart would be exhilarating, 500kmh an hour in a jumbo jet is boring.
     
  9. GreyImport

    GreyImport Administrator Staff Member The Chief Contributing Member

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    Amen to that .... well said :thumb_ups:
     
  10. mboddy

    mboddy Well-Known Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    Two defining moments for me were:

    In 1978 the boss let me take his BMW R90S. I am riding along in an 80kmh zone thinking I am just doing the legal speed and I look at the speedo and I am doing 140. Decided that any bike that feels like it is doing 80 when it is doing 140 is not my thing. I would rather it felt like 140 when doing 80.

    Decided to do some test rides of bigger bikes in 1993. Rode lots of them. The worst was a Triumph speed triple - it never felt happy under 160. The best was a BMW R1100S. But the reason I didn't get it was I took my TDR250 for a ride after. The BMW was as good as the TDR in a lot of ways but wasn't any better. So I stuck with the TDR.
     
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  11. Murdo

    Murdo The Good Doctor Staff Member Contributing Member Ride and Events Crew

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    I was not inferring any riders were lazy etc, I was refering to the way in which some big bikes eg; Hardleys, Triumph rocket 3, etc, delivered lazy power with the twist of the wrist.
    Anybody who can keep a 600/1,000cc bike on the boil has big respect from me, I know I couldn't do it. I spend more time on my 650 than any of the 250's I own, but I enjoy riding the smaller bikes more.
     
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  12. Linkin

    Linkin The Mechanic Premium Member Contributing Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    That's another thing. These old inline 4 250's have a cult following because they are the only ones of their kind. They all beat the snot out of the new 250's, they have racing ergo's, and all redline at 18k+ RPM. What's not to love? Sure it's not as comfortable as a new bike, the carbs will always need work, etc etc etc, BUT! (and that's a big but!!!) once you have all the mechanical issues sorted, there is no other bike, LAMS or no, that comes close to the fun you have wringing the neck on a CBR/ZXR/GSXR/FZR 250 inline 4, and keep your license at the same time.

    2nd gear redline on my FZR? 80KM/h or so. Try that on a 400/600/1000 bike and see how quickly you lose your license or backflip the bike because of the power.

    These old 250's i4's are practically made to have the guts thrashed out of them.
     
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  13. mboddy

    mboddy Well-Known Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    Don't forget the 2 strokes. They go wicked fast too.
     
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  14. Ian B.

    Ian B. Active Member

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    I have ridden many bikes over the years, from a Suzuki TS125s to Suzuki Katana 1100s. I like the 250 class (especially 2-strokes) because it reminds me of when I was 18 and just starting out. Every journey was an odyssey, with one ear firmly tuned to the engine to make sure it wasn't about to grenade and the other tuned to other imminent mechanical failure. The magic 100 mph (or close to it) was in reach for the first time as long as the damn thing held together or you didn't lose your nerve and even if it it broke, well, there was always a way to patch it up despite a severe lack of cash (that's what breaker's yards were for. I could choose any bike I want now, but I guess I never had as much fun as with my 250 2-strokes.

    Just my 2C.

    Ian B.
     
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  15. KICKERMAN360

    KICKERMAN360 Well-Known Member

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    If you do mods correctly, a 250 2 stroke (NSR, RGV, RS etc) can have the same power/weight ratio to a 600. Sort of in a different category to 4 stroke bikes.

    I guess for most people there's a bit of nostalgia with the small bikes too. For me, my MC22 was my first road bike. My '98 CR125 for my first big dirt bike bike as well, so I like it too even though it looks like a turd (a polished one mind you). I liked my MC22 for a bunch of reasons but it had character. On a cold morning you might have to manipulate the throttle and play with the choke to fire it up. Or you could wring it out and have the shift lights flashing and still be under the speed limit. Or ride down the street and have every one turn their heads. It's just a fun little bike that ticks many boxes and was economical.

    But I'll stress there are serious downsides to 250s that I think we can all agree to. For a start they're not the best for extended stints on the highway. I hated riding from the Gold Coast to Brisbane on my bike and would prefer the car. But around town and up in the hills was a blast. Another thing is it's hard to find a 250 that is well taken care of and if you decide to go the rebuild route, it's money that is lost because it won't add to the resale value. I spent probably 2k on my bike over the years and it wouldn't have increased in value one cent. Another thing is overtaking people requires a serious run up, especially over 80 kph. And for the engine size, are quite loud.

    So there are plenty of reasons to get a bigger bike. Definitely get a 600 or bigger for highways, or a newer bike with fuel injection if you let the bike sit, or simply want a bike with a fairly good service record. But if you're mechanically inclined, like working on bikes and can appreciate the ride for what it is then 250s are a bunch of fun. Like i said before, my MC22 had character and little quirks that I liked. But the 600RR is so perfect that it has none of that. It starts easily, the power is there in every gear, it stops so well I can barely stay on the bike. My 600 is fun, but I have more fun exploiting the 250 a bunch.

    I can't wait til I can take my MC21 out, as I'm keen to see how it compares.
     
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  16. Joker

    Joker See "about me" for contact details. Contributing Member

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    Couldn't agree with you more Chris - especially that last sentence. I am not intending to point the finger at the members of this forum, just a general comment more than anything else. I'm not wanting people to get all worked up and for the most part hopefully people aren't.

    @Revolver simply put mate I've been riding 10 years, all apart from one of those years I've owned road bikes. Now I'm not going to pass that off coupled with some arrogant attitude as though I'm the most experienced rider, I know everything or I know better than anyone else because I'm not and I don't. Although I've ridden many bikes over the years both big and small, I much prefer a bigger bike around the 600-900cc range. I've stated the reasons above as to why. I personally don't see the need for me to have any more power than that for everyday riding (for example I'd much prefer the GSXR750 over the GSXR1000 as I think the former is much more pleasant to ride under normal circumstances).

    I don't necessarily agree you need a smaller bike to hone your skills. For me you need to rack up riding experience, regardless of the bike. The reason I think this is because from my own personal experience, a smaller bike behaves very differently to a bigger bike - so really only the basic riding skills are transferable. I'd even go as far as to say the FZR250 vs the CBR250RR probably require different skills as well (I've never ridden a CBR250RR though).

    Going back to a 250cc now I feel a bit like I'm on an overpowered bicycle... it took quite a bit of getting used to, more than anything the feeling I have to thrash the crap out of it to make it go. The effortless power (for me) is a luxury I liked so much and became so accustomed to on my old 750 I definitely miss it.

    As for the bigger bike experience kind of thing, sure, under a lot of circumstances their abilities need to be throttled back for everyday road use. That's not necessarily a bad thing though - at least it's there when you need it...

    Yep jumbo jets are boring. For realism though, try a 15hp kart vs a 90hp superkart... a more accurate comparison I would think? :)
     
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  17. Mclaren

    Mclaren Well-Known Member Contributing Member

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    Take the fzr on track against guys who can ride a 250 fast and u maybe surprised at what they can do mate trust me
     
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  18. Moo

    Moo Plodge Racing!!!

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    just on a side note..........doing this on a 250 can result in a FAR cheaper repair bill than the same on a 600 or a 1000....just saying like :p hahahah

    IMG_2976.JPG IMG_2977.JPG IMG_2978.JPG IMG_2979.JPG IMG_2980.JPG
     
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  19. Joker

    Joker See "about me" for contact details. Contributing Member

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    I think it depends on whether you're riding an import or not, right? :D
     
  20. Joker

    Joker See "about me" for contact details. Contributing Member

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    Especially for something like this, @Moo?

     
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