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Help Spada bottom end

Discussion in 'Honda 250cc Twins' started by Gizziracer, Aug 7, 2018.

  1. Gizziracer

    Gizziracer Active Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    Ahhhh Traps for the unwary. I was speaking to a Spada expert and he told me of a number of times where Spadas sounded as though they were close to imminent explosion. Owners were sure there was a failing bearing or faulty cam chain tensioner and it turns out to be the 3 bolts that secure the starter clutch sometimes wirk themselves loose . Sure enough, took of the clutch cover and there they were, 3 starter clutch bolts about to fall out. The motor sounds like it just rolled off the production line now. Perfect.
     
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  2. maelstrom

    maelstrom LiteTek Staff Member Premium Member 250cc Vendor Contributing Member

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    Might be a good idea to ask Mr @GreyImport to post those two tips into a separate sticky called "Spada Owners Read This" or something similar.
     
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  3. Macdaug

    Macdaug Member

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    Hey mate, where exactly are the "starter clutch bolts" i have a super loud death rattle at idle and low rpm, sounds like the bottom end, but it disappears at top end, trying to isolate it.

    Was is the clutch basket? or starter motor?
     
  4. my67xr

    my67xr Bike Enthusiast Staff Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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  5. Gizziracer

    Gizziracer Active Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    If you remove the right side engine cover, (source a new gasket first, $10 from wemoto, $30 from Honda), then the clutch basket, the starter clutch is behind this, it will be instantly obvious if these are loose, make sure the 3 starter clutch bolts are tight and locktight back in place,
     
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  6. Macdaug

    Macdaug Member

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    I cant believe it! these three bolts were loose, tighted up and good as gold. How strange not to have them locktite in the first place. Now onto my electrical issues :D
     
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  7. Gizziracer

    Gizziracer Active Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    They were locktited in the first place, at the factory, by honda. Remember this is a 30 year old motorcycle of unknown history. All imports have an unknown service history in Japan before being delivered in Australia where numerous home mechanics have dabbled. Your bike may have a low kilometer speedo reading but its possibly no a true reflection of the distance its travelled. Of the numerous spadas I have rebuilt only one has needed this fix. Its sort of nice to be able to repair something that sounds so nasty for the cost of a gasket:)
     
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  8. Macdaug

    Macdaug Member

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    I wonder if you can help with my other spada issues, this one is a shed find with all sorts of quirks. Tacho almost works in reverse and when I pull the clutch lever the temp needle flat lines then spikes on release. like a short somewhere, I'm going to start by cleaning all switch blocks.
     
  9. Gizziracer

    Gizziracer Active Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    Wow, I think you may have goblins living in your sumpremoving the wires on the clutch lever that control the neutral starter motor kill switch will solve one issue . Check wiring if someone has cut into the loom somewhere and modified something. Also remove instruments, remove back of console and look for wiring tampering and clean up all terminals with computer circuit board cleaner.
     
  10. Gizziracer

    Gizziracer Active Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    Also, there is an earth connection on the right hand side of the battery box to the chassis, check that this is clean and tight, then remove front of headlight and check/clean all connectors, pay special attention to the one that runs to the instrument console, seperate all connectors, clean and check none of the pins have retracted in the housing
     
  11. Macdaug

    Macdaug Member

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    The loom is all stock, nothing tampered visually that I can see, has been garaged for the past 7 years, so I suspect some corrosion somewhere, will start with the instrument cluster, how does the neutral position work again? It's only starts when in nuetral, kick down or up, and clutch lever in. Will not start any other way, from memory it should start with kick up, clutch in, any gear?
     
  12. Macdaug

    Macdaug Member

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    Removing the coolant temp sensor resets the temp gauge back to cold, looks like a dodgy sensor.
    The only other quirk i need to work out is: There is no dash light or parker light, but the clutch lever switch is engaged, the parker and dash illuminate even when running. The engine also seems to rev higher with the clutch enguaged. Any help here would be appreciated.
     
  13. Gizziracer

    Gizziracer Active Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    It’s possibly a poor earth, the neutral light in dash, neutral starter motor cut out in the clutch lever, neutral switch on the right side of the sump(near the oil level sight hole) are all related and no doubt other parts of the circuit come into play. Fortunately for me I usually just start replacing individual items at the most likely suspect until the issue is fixed, Then work my way back replacing the un damaged components. (the shed full of spada parts does come in mighty handy at times.) I can help you out with a temp sensor if required.
     
  14. Macdaug

    Macdaug Member

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    Bad earth traced to the battery box, previous owner had a painted washer installed. No ground there!
    Next up, trying to remove a broken tacho needle, tried the two spoon method to pop it off the shaft, it's well and truly stuck on, i don't want to damage anything using too much force, should I try some heat or even a dremel to carefully remove it?
     
  15. Gizziracer

    Gizziracer Active Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    I use 2 flat head screw drivers 180degrees apart inserted under the centre of the needle. Put something on the tacho face to protect it, I use gaffa tape. Then twist the drivers sideways in unison. You can apply a lot of controlled force this way. WARNING, wear eye protection and if your shed is anything like mine never expect to find it again. The other , less violent and dangerous method is to carefully dremel the broken needle away and super glue a plastic tooth pick (dodgey ???? Me,,,,,,,,,, never:). One problem I have encountered is if the needles are painted with enamel paint sometimes when the bike is left in the sun the paint becomes soft and sticky enough to stick to the needle stop. A light tap on the taco usually frees them but its probably best to ensure no paint is applied to the tiny area that contacts the stop. Also make sure the new needle is pretty much the same dimensions as the original one, its possible for them to catch on the housing, its quite a close fit.
     
  16. Macdaug

    Macdaug Member

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    I'm going to see if I can frankenstein old needles from car dash and epoxy them on. I don't want to pay big bucks to have it replaced, nor do I want break anything else while prying away.
     
  17. Macdaug

    Macdaug Member

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    Wow I've really hijacked this thread :D.. anyhow, next problem is the front carb is not atomising fuel at all. I've pulled the carbs 3 times and cleaned as much as possible. I can confirm this by pouring some petrol down the throat, and it runs on both cylinders as opposed to one.
    Might be time for professional rebuild, but seems weird that it has no idle or main jet considering the rear carb is fine.
     
  18. Gizziracer

    Gizziracer Active Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    Take jets out again, leave them soaking in carburetor cleaner overnight, then blow with compressed air, do a visual check holding them up to a light, you can sometimes actually see the build up of crud inside them that looks like a jagged edge, poke something through them if there is still junk and blow them out again with carby cleaner then compressed air. occasionally they are beyond saving, I don't understand why. I have occasionally had pristine looking jets that have been scrubbed to within an inch of their lives,(gently) and they just fail to work any more. Single jets are available from numerous honda suppliers or carburetor specialists. You can purchase spada carb rebild kits on ebay for around $65, obviously you need 2 so it is a bit spendy. Also , before you start throwing substantial amounts of cash at the carburetors check that all the main rubber parts are ok. The rubber diaphram in the accelerator pump and the large one on top of the slide. If these also need replacing your going to be up for well over $200 in parts. AND....some people will want to shoot me for this..... you can purchase a perfectly functioning , full set of Chinese, vt250 Spada knock off carbs for round $250. I kept looking at these on the net, wondering if they were just rubbish then my inquisitive mind got the better of me,(and it was one of those rare times I had a little bit of spare cash) and I purchased a pair. I now use them as my test set to help diagnose motor issues and get non runners running quickly. They seem to work perfectly and are visually and dimensionaly identical to the originals. Obviously I have no idea how well the rubber parts will last over time but they certainly seem like an amazingly well manufactured unit.
     
  19. Macdaug

    Macdaug Member

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    I've pulled the carbs again and going to soak all day. The jets look perfect, the only thing Incan think of is a blockage in one of the routes inside the carb or low compression on front cylinder. Although it fires great manually. If this doesn't work might be time for a kit.
     
  20. Gizziracer

    Gizziracer Active Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    Ebay ad number for these knock off carbs is
    264265503708

    image.jpg image.jpg
     

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