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Drag Racing 1978 Suzuki TS185 Nostalgia Bike

Discussion in 'Motorcycle Racing and Track Days' started by Frankster, Mar 22, 2020.

  1. Frankster

    Frankster See the World before you leave it Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew

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    ... it may not have been the swingarm twisting but the engine moving under acceleration making the chain swerve and fling about.

    It certainly felt like that, but Murdo raced it before without any issues, so maybe the 10 years sitting around did all the damage?
     
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  2. ruckusman

    ruckusman Well-Known Member Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    Rubber perishes and hardens just with time - a good solution to all of those rubbers will go a long way to reducing vibrations

    For some depending on the exterior dimensions skateboard truck polyurethane rubbers may work well

    There's a place in Sydney in Brookvale that makes everything imaginable in polyeurathane and the like, I just cannot think what their business category is so that you can find an equivalent - perhaps plastic engineering, just checked, the place that I knew of is gone
     
  3. Andych

    Andych Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    Pretty sure you can get Nolathane in bar stock etc ( well you used to be able to) so making your own polyurethane bushes shouldn’t be too difficult.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
     
  4. GreyImport

    GreyImport Administrator Staff Member The Chief Contributing Member

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    In the Land Cruiser world nolathane bushes are a no no as they are stiff and and have no flex/give in them ... rubber only .... so it depends what u want while going in a straight line :)
     
  5. ruckusman

    ruckusman Well-Known Member Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    More oil reduces the Octane rating so your 50:1 mix will yield better resistance to detonation
     
  6. Murdo

    Murdo The Good Doctor Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew Contributing Member

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    Time does seem to have taken its toll on the rubber bushings. Can you get them out of the engine cases?
    Did you check for loose flywheel?
    The flywheel from the box is from a CDI set up and will not work with the points. The HT coil is from using a 12 volt battery. The the magneto coil is the lighting/charging coil of the DT. Spare condenser.
     
  7. ruckusman

    ruckusman Well-Known Member Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    OK so I started reading on bushes - this page is good info - nolathane is available in 74 & 85 durometer

    https://www.nolathane.com.au/faq.php

    For comparison an 85 durometer skateboard wheel would be considered soft, for a skateboard wheel, for comparison, there are harder skateboard wheels above 95, they are like hardwood and you could hammer nails with them

    The 74 durometer would likely be a good choice for those bushes potentially.

    The bonus is, they have this page https://www.nolathane.com.au/catsize_bush.php

    So you may be able to see if they've got anything in the sizes you need quickly and easily
     
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  8. Frankster

    Frankster See the World before you leave it Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew

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    Time does seem to have taken its toll on the rubber bushings. Can you get them out of the engine cases? I will try
    Did you check for loose flywheel? It seemed okay (see below) nothing loose and seemed to spin without wobble. IMG_0631.JPG
     
  9. Frankster

    Frankster See the World before you leave it Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew

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    So, what's the consensus? Rubber or Urethane? That website that Ruckus pointed me to might have something. Not sure where I'd get rubber bushes from. @GreyImport where do you land cruiser folks go for yours?

    https://www.nolathane.com.au/catsize_search.php
     
  10. ruckusman

    ruckusman Well-Known Member Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    Actually now that I've posted that urethane might work, it probably won't damp the vibes enough as it's more rigid on the scale than rubber across the board, even with the softer stuff, unless you got urethane outers and could slip rubber hose over the bolts then into the urethane

    It would be nice to be able to go to a suspension place and say, I need some like this in rubber and have someone who is across all of the parts know where to look and thinking on it there's rubber bushings all over cars supporting transmission and other components
     
  11. Frankster

    Frankster See the World before you leave it Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew

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    So, rubber it is then?
     
  12. Andych

    Andych Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    Hardness is hardness... your rubber bushes will most likely be 70 Durometer so using 74 Durometer Nolathane would be a little stiffer but not the same as a solid mount.
    Lots thumper engines are solid mounted so it shouldnt be an issue.
    Landcruisers require compliance in their suspension hence they prefer rubber. Interesting as Leaf spring Off road suspension users prefer to use Nolathane so it really is up to the user... I would use standard OEM Shock rubbers which would have steel tubes inside them but on the engine... I would go for the Nolathane. Make sure the ID is correct and that way you could crudely machine down the OD using a drill and file if you had to.
    Nolathane type material is also used in Street performance car suspension to improve stiffness and reduce the compliance built in for comfort...

    I mean most racing engines are solid mounted to ensure all the geometry stays where it is meant to be and there is no movement.
     
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  13. risky

    risky risky

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    if you go urethane-if you freeze it it can be machined in a lathe. so can industrial nylon.if you wish to make a mould urethane can be melted , poured in mould and allowed to set again.
     
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    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 25, 2020 at 9:58 AM
  14. Frankster

    Frankster See the World before you leave it Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew

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    To solid mount this engine, I will need to get thicker bolts.
     
  15. Andych

    Andych Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    No need to solid mount it but using an easy to obtain material like Nolathane that you can make up your own bushes with and have it a little stiffer than standard rubber (if you can get them) isnt a bad option.
    Remember the engine etc was all mounted for somebody to ride on a daily basis.. be it on the road or on the trail.. Yours will run for very short periods in a straight line (mostly) Comfort isnt a high priority I would think.
     
  16. Frankster

    Frankster See the World before you leave it Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew

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    Comfort isn't a high priority I would think.

    No it's not, but when I say this thing vibrates like a jack hammer, I'm not exaggerating. You can see from my previous posts how the chain is smashing against the frame and chainguard. This isn't a "comfort" exercise Andy.
     
  17. GreyImport

    GreyImport Administrator Staff Member The Chief Contributing Member

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    Alot use genuine but the aftermarket scene is huge

    https://select4wd.com.au/products/80-series-bush-kit

    When I replaced the bushes on that trailer I cart the bikes in , it is 'homemade' so I took the old bushes in and the guy at Bursons found some that would fit .... they needed a bit of remodelling , but did the job
     
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  18. GreyImport

    GreyImport Administrator Staff Member The Chief Contributing Member

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  19. Andych

    Andych Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    I never meant it along those lines Frank
    For the chain to be doing that the engine must be moving around... problem is you dont know the Durometer hardness of what the original engine rubber mounts are so trying to come up with an equivalent using rubber hose or similar probably wont do much for your problem.
    The type of rubberised mounts for your engine from the factory would be bonded rubber onto a metal tube... mostly for cushioning the engine vibration while maintaining alignment etc.. most would probably be in the 90 Durometer range to ensure there want excessive movement... your rubber has obviously broken down over time and the movement would be excessive.

    Nolathane does have some compliance depending on the Durometer specs and is used in lots of performance applications plus is easily machined. Hence it makes for a much better proposition for replacement engine mounts to ensure some vibration absorbtion while limiting the movement of the engine as unit.
     
  20. Frankster

    Frankster See the World before you leave it Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew

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    The type of rubberised mounts for your engine from the factory would be bonded rubber onto a metal tube... mostly for cushioning the engine vibration while maintaining alignment etc.

    I think there are a few issues at play on this bike. The dried up rubber mounts and the 2mm of play just add to my list. I will try and mount the engine as best I can before taking it for a run. I will know pretty quickly if there are still issues with the vibration. The head shake issues might be partially from the vibration. I have to pull the forks apart to have a look and put heavier fluid in them. Both the front and rear shocks are spongy and slow to rebound.
     
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