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Subaru clutch replacement

Discussion in 'The Pub' started by ruckusman, Oct 25, 2018.

  1. ruckusman

    ruckusman Well-Known Member Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    Guys,

    I know this is a motorbike forum, but the wealth of talent and experience makes me think that someone may have successfully completed this task.

    Just wondering if anyone has replaced the clutch on their Subaru by shifting the engine forward after removal of the radiator etc to make space, i.e. not lifting it all the way out on a gantry.

    I should mention that the cost t get the job done by a mechanic is more than the car is worth - it's a beater

    Reason I ask is because I don't have a hoist to do the transmission removal method, don't have a gantry or a good work space for one, but thought that shifting the engine forward may be sufficient for space

    This is a good vid

    I suppose that if I sort everything for engine removal I can hire a gantry and get it sorted if need be in a pinch - the clutch replacement part of the process is a piece of cake
     
  2. Wozza

    Wozza Active Member

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    Never done a subie but I dont think you will have sufficient room to clear the input shaft....pop over to the mighty car mods forum they have a very big DIY crew and a subaru fan base...
     
  3. Andych

    Andych Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    I would check out FB marketplace and Gumtree for an engine hoist... I bought one on special from eBay for $250, used it to remove one engine and trans in a Mazda 323 and swap it for another...did it all in one weekend and then sold the hoist for $220 so it only cost $30... it can be done.. and is faster, safer and a lot less hassle.
    I have a cheapie clutch alignment tool I could send you but I am not going to be home for a few weeks and nobody else is game to step foot in my Garage
     
  4. my67xr

    my67xr Bike Enthusiast Staff Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    I know what you mean about the supply and fit cost, i was quoted $900 to S&F a new clutch to my wife's 1998 Mazda 626, we sold it as is a bit cheaper

    I'm interested if it can be done without removing the engine fully on the Subie too, we have a 03 Forester that need's a thrust bearing (It squeaks etc when your foot isn't on the clutch)
    i reckon i'll wait till the clutch slip's/goes and replace the lot at the same time.
    I have a h/duty crane you could borrow too but i'm a bit far away i reckon.
     
  5. ruckusman

    ruckusman Well-Known Member Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    Thanks Wozza - I'll pop over there and see what they say, I haven't popped the bonnet to check the clearance with the radiator removed, but I am hopeful and at any rate I'll hoist the engine out rather than lay underneath if it come to that
     
  6. ruckusman

    ruckusman Well-Known Member Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    Here's the annoying thing, when I rebuilt the engine on Mum's Barina I made an engine hoist for the cost of materials, it also doubled as an engine stand, when I moved I ran out of space, so it went the great recycling centre in the sky - this time I'll probably just hire one if need be, hopefully I won't need to.

    I'm hoping the kit comes with the alignment tool, ones I've seen on ebay seem to.
     
  7. ruckusman

    ruckusman Well-Known Member Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    I'll take pics as I go and try and document it for you - minimum will be removing the radiator and I also need to check what the service interval is for the timing belt as I may just do that at the same time if it's close to due.

    My clutch is so bad that I'm at the point when I just can't put my foot down, but I look at cars as a PITA, bikes are so much better unless you've got cargo and passengers

    Now if I could only stop the damn thing rusting I'd keep it until it dies completely
     
  8. Wozza

    Wozza Active Member

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    Amen to that ...never again :D
    landy.jpg
     
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  9. ruckusman

    ruckusman Well-Known Member Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    Hey Guys,

    bringing this one up again - looking for an engine hoist that I can hire hopefully from someone on the forums which can be anywhere between Narrabeen in Sydney and somewhere, hopefully not too far out of the way to Mansfield which is in North East rural Victoria

    Long story short I did the clutch replacement on the ground with the front of the car on jack stands by removing the transmission and everything else to get it done - lying on damp carpet in 6 degrees, and, in twit fashion I screwed up fitting the new rear main seal so now need to essentially do it over again but this time I'm going to remove the engine and need a hoist to accomplish that.

    Hoping to be traveling back from Narrabeen to Mansfield this weekend

    I did search gumtree for something local to mansfield but came up empty and I don't really want to purchase one, I can rent one from Coates hire in Shepparton but I'd be happier paying rental fees to a forum member

    Anyway open to suggestions
     
  10. Andych

    Andych Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    I needed on to do an engine swap on a Mazda 232 for my daughter and found the best way was to purchase one new on eBay...I managed to get one that was on 20% off at the time do the work.. clean it up (if it got dirty) and then sell it again on ebay or gumtree.. ended up costing me about $40 but there were no time issues (rental is by days or weeks normally) so it worked out really well.
    I picked my time to sell it as well.. making sure none were on special... might be worth investigating.
     
  11. Murdo

    Murdo The Good Doctor Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew Contributing Member

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    Years go I lifted a 2LT Pinto motor from a Cortina using the frame of my kids swing set and an endless chain. It groaned a bit but held ok.
     
  12. my67xr

    my67xr Bike Enthusiast Staff Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    The Suby engine's weigh under 140kg with all bolt on's
     
  13. Andych

    Andych Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    Plus the gearbox...
    I am with @ruckusman in using an engine hoist...especially if you are by yourself... too easy to hurt yourself..
    I once lifted a Datsun 1600 out by using ropes over my shoulders hunched over and then standing up in the engine bay...
    Young and stupid... might be why I have back problems these days.
     
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  14. my67xr

    my67xr Bike Enthusiast Staff Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    140kg should be ok with a block and tackle on a shed frame or even a decently built verandah beam
     
  15. Andych

    Andych Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    Engine and gearbox ( depending on the gearbox ) will be 180 kg which is probably a bit much for verandah beams etc


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
     
  16. ruckusman

    ruckusman Well-Known Member Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    I do like the block and tackle ideas, and yes I've already queried about if anyone has a swing set that I can borrow, no luck unfortunately

    I am veering away from purchasing the hoist then selling it, because I usually just don't get around to selling stuff on, I stick stuff in the corner then cover it with something else

    I have had a look at the garage beam - it looks to be solid timber so I'm reticent to just drilling holes through it, though I would probably be allowed, which leaves me buying a block and tackle and that may end up being as much as hiring a hoist, perhaps with the same amount of travel

    Engine will be divorced from the transmission for the lift - the transmission is weighty, I would put it between 60-80kgs at a guess

    The crazy man part of me says I could straddle the engine bay and lift it in increments, but like refitting the transmission, the knack is going to be getting it back down to level - I did a lot of bicep work underneath getting the transmission back in, in conjunction with ratchet straps around old snow skis, minus bindings, across the engine bay - that was one slow, tedious, physically difficult task I can tell you, but I did it - the one take away from that was only a certifiably crazy person would have attempted to do it that way in the first place and stubbornness was the sole reason for my success
     
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  17. Murdo

    Murdo The Good Doctor Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew Contributing Member

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    Don't drill a hole in the beam just put a strap over it under the sheeting.
     
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  18. ruckusman

    ruckusman Well-Known Member Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    That's a really good idea, I'll get up on a ladder and see if there's the possibility of slipping a strap through - I have four straps, so could use the same method of using them one after the other to get the lift I need with the ratchet straps - makes life simpler
     
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  19. my67xr

    my67xr Bike Enthusiast Staff Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    My wifes' 2003 Subaru Forester clutch sort of went the other day, the clutch fork broke on one side
    I chased up a new one and some new retaining clip's from Subaru, and thought i'd replace the Thrust bearing at the same time
    No one had the thrust bearing locally so i had to do a 2 hour round trip to pick one up, i also grabbed a new spiggot bearing just incase the squeak was coming from that.
    While i was at the clutch shop i asked for a price on a new clutch kit, our Forester has a dual mass flywheel set up which cost's $1800 for an aftermarket kit, they also gave me the option of converting it to a single mass flywheel and clutch kit which was only $750
    I came home and told my wife the price's, she couldn't believe it.

    Anyway a mate and i decided to use my engine gantry and split the engine and box in the car to replace the broken fork and fit a new thrust bearing on Sunday afternoon, took us just over an hour to split the engine and have it sitting up against the radiator support panel (radiator removed)
    There is about 150mm gap between the back of the engine and the front of the gearbox when they're split so there's enough room to replace a fork or thrust bearing.
    Might be a bit tight doing a full clutch replacement, and the engine would rock around a bit too
    My mate noticed the clutch plate didn't look too good and the spiggot bearing had fallen apart so we decided to pull the engine right out
    We took the clutch off the flywheel and the clutch plate was worn out so needed a new clutch
    I went with the single mass flywheel conversion and picked that up yesterday afternoon
    The other thing i noticed was the flywheel bolt's, they were what looked to be T50 Torx.
    When i went to undo them with my T50 Torx bit it was very loose in the bolt ?
    I was able to undo 1 bolt out of the 8 that hold the flywheel on, but the second bolt was very tight, the spline's on my Torx bit started to turn so i stopped trying
    I came back inside and did some research on Subaru flywheel bolt's, turn's out they're not T50, they are TP50 which is another heavy duty Torx style bolt known as a Torx Plus, each spline on the TP50 is about 2mm thick and squarish instead of 1mm thick and rounded so that was why the T50 felt a bit loose in the bolt.
    The Torx Plus bolt's are used in heavy duty application's like flywheel bolt's, seat belt bolt's and some GM transmission's, they're also used on some late model Harley Davidson's
    There's also another similar style Torx bolt used on a lot of European car's, it's use's a Ribe bit / Polydrive bit

    Next problem was finding a TP50 socket or TP50 bit, i rang around about 10 shop's today and no one had ever heard of a TP50, i had to explain the difference to each shop.
    2x shop's said they could order one in for me but only had a monthly order with the supplier in Melbourne so that didn't help.
    I remembered a mobile tool guy that i used to use when i had my workshop year's ago and gave him a call.
    I asked him if he kept a Torx Plus TP50 socket or bit in stock, he asked me if i was changing a Subaru clutch and flywheel by any chance ?
    I laughed and said yes, and he said he had one or 2 in stock and would pop over in an hour and sell one to me, yay !
    He arrived and i bought one off of him, the new socket cost me $44 but i couldn't do anything without it and my wife wanted her car fixed...

    So tomorrow i can pull the old flywheel off and start fitting the new flywheel and clutch then refit the engine to get the car back on the road again

    What a fun job doing a Subaru clutch is !!

    Old dual mass flywheel with a dead spiggot bearing, the cage was mashed and it's missing a few bearing's
    I had to remove the outer half of the flywheel that the clutch plate sits on to get to the flywheel bolts
    You can see the spring loaded strut's hanging inside the flywheel, they help to soften the connection from engine to transmission and help's the gearbox to last longer and with less vibration's etc
    I also welded a piece of steel to the flywheel and drilled a hole to sit over the dowel pin to keep it from turning when i undid the bolt's

    20190826_104229.jpg



    And here's a pic showing the difference between a T50 Torx head and a TP50 Torx head

    torx v Torx plus.jpg

    Ribe bolt, Torx bit's are loose in these as well, not sure if all Ribe bolt's are marked Ribe though ?

    28374199100_3de75d188f_b.jpg
     
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    Last edited: Aug 27, 2019
  20. ruckusman

    ruckusman Well-Known Member Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    Sounds like you're havling almost as much fun as I did - in hindsight doing the clutch from underneath lowering the transmission was the daftest approach, which was why when I screwed the rear main seal installation I got hold of a gantry. It's a much less ugly job, and I didn't have to deal with the dual mass flywheel malarky.

    For what it's worth I borrowed a Ryobi impact driver to remove the flywheel bolts because stopping it from rotating when doing it the first time made a 10 minutes job into a 1.5 hour long job - spanner to hold and long socket arm to remove, and that was without having to deal with the TP50 drive, only standard bolts on mine.

    The good thing is that I also did the seals on the transmission as the front one had a small leak, that plus the rear main seal done correctly on the second try and there isn't a sign of a single drop of oil leaking now.

    You'll be glad for having replaced the clutch and flywheel, actually surprised it hadn't been converted before now as the dual mass flywheel seemed to be a consistent point of failure in all of the reading that I did.

    I managed to get my engine back in on my own, some wiggling and a jack underneath the transmission to adjust the height, then once that was done, the slow process of reattaching everything.

    It's not a job I'd undertake again unless it's a car that's worth the effort, which mine isn't really, but lesson learned
     
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