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Project Suzuki Across Engine Rebuild

Discussion in 'Your 250cc Projects' started by Jethalter, Mar 27, 2019.

  1. Jethalter

    Jethalter Active Member Premium Member

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    Part number i get is 08221-10185. I will have to measure the size of the ones i had come out, there was only 5 and it didnt make sense why they were there.
     
  2. maelstrom

    maelstrom LiteTek Staff Member Premium Member 250cc Vendor Contributing Member

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  3. my67xr

    my67xr Bike Enthusiast Staff Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    Yep you're right with the shim's starting 08221, that's probably why i couldn't find that part number
    They might have a different diameter or I/D, i worked out that the other shim's were for the last W model
     
  4. Jethalter

    Jethalter Active Member Premium Member

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    I measured the shims today, they are 0.50mm thick.
    When i get the chance i'm going to rig up a scale on my mill, and check the spring pressures.
    If they are all in spec (higher of the range), i don't think the shims are needed. if any on the low side, i'll add the shim and retest.
     
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  5. my67xr

    my67xr Bike Enthusiast Staff Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    I reckon Suzuki show them in the diagram for a reason,
    otherwise Suzuki could have saved themselves about .50c + per engine they built by not using them and that's add up to quite a bit of money when you work out how many engine's Suzuki made.
     
  6. Jethalter

    Jethalter Active Member Premium Member

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    I figure they are there for a reason, but what that reason is im trying to work out.
    My dilemma is there isn't even 8 of them, there is only 5 out of 16 valves.
    So my only thought i can work out is if some of the spring have a slightly lower spring pressure. Use these shims to compensate.

    Then again in the diagram, it shows it on the exhaust side only, not the inlet. so nfi.
    So i'm just going to check all the spring pressures and if they are all the same i won't be using them, if there is some that are low, i'll re measure with a shim and see if it bumps it up.

    What else can i do ???
     
  7. my67xr

    my67xr Bike Enthusiast Staff Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    Just buy 3 more and use them under all 8 exhaust valve spring seat's, easy as.
     
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  8. Jethalter

    Jethalter Active Member Premium Member

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    I think a couple were under inlet valves as well.
    So it makes it what do i do.
    Again i'll check spring pressures with and without, see where we are at. Maybe just get a full set of i have 16 and put them in all the valves ???
     
  9. Linkin

    Linkin The Apprentice Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club Contributing Member

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    If the parts diagram is to be believed, then they should only go under the exhaust valves... the only reason that comes to mind for that is to assist them with proper seating, as exhaust valves get very hot and if they don't seat, they will overheat and burn up.
     
  10. my67xr

    my67xr Bike Enthusiast Staff Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    Wait you didn't mark what came from where? That can cause problem's later
    You said earlier in this post they all came from the exhaust spring seat's



    I would be checking for valve spring coil bind on the inlet spring's if you use shim's there, Suzuki don't list shim's for the inlet side.
    If the shim's were just for spring's that were worn and had lost tension, and possibly to correct recessed valve seat's, the part's list would only say 1 instead of 8.
    I'd hate to get valve bounce at 15,000 rpm, or even worse have an exhaust valve hit the piston at those rev's.
    Guess in the end it's up to you what you decide to run with
     
  11. Jethalter

    Jethalter Active Member Premium Member

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    I didn't get them out, they literally fell out when i was checking valve seats.
    I'm pretty sure one or two were inlet side.
    Its a pity the manual doesn't list the stem height like the kawasaki manual does.
    Plan is at the moment, i'll test spring pressures at its rated height. I dont imagine there is much different than what the factory specs list, if they test within spec(will also get readings with shims to see difference) i'll fit the shims on the exhaust valves.
    Other thing i noticed is the buckets for the inlet and exhaust are different. Perhaps this has to do with the shims also ???
    Going over the manual it doesn't refer to those shims :-(

    Ahh just found the parts list suzuki book ( not the website parts fiche), i see what you mean now with the 2 different part numbers. And your right it does list 8 for the exhaust valves only. Think i cant go wrong if i go that route.
     
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    Last edited: Mar 30, 2019
  12. my67xr

    my67xr Bike Enthusiast Staff Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    Yeah bucket's are a different thickness, maybe the intake and exhaust valve's are different length's too ?
     
  13. Jethalter

    Jethalter Active Member Premium Member

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    Could be, i'll measure them tomorrow, surprisingly feel a lot better than i should be, had no pain today from surgery so if tomorrow is good, might just take it easy and measure some things up to confirm the plan. Got lots of things to measure and check which should be easy but just take some time.

    I think as you said, safest bet, put all those shims on exhaust side like that parts manual lists.
     
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  14. Jethalter

    Jethalter Active Member Premium Member

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    So i tested the springs, wasn't happy with the setup but it was good enough to get an idea now.
    Each spring @ 35.3mm compressed, gave 14.0kg min to max of 14.2kg.
    When the washer was added, spring pressure went upto 17.2kg avg.

    So i'm just gotta get some shims like the diagram and add them in the exhaust only.
     
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  15. Murdo

    Murdo The Good Doctor Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew Contributing Member

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    Are you sure you got them all out? Any still stuck in the head?
     
  16. Jethalter

    Jethalter Active Member Premium Member

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    yup im sure they all out, none are left in the head or stuck on the bottom of the valve spring seats
     
  17. Jethalter

    Jethalter Active Member Premium Member

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    Got my shims, head gasket, valve cover gasket and base gasket. Just waiting on rings and valve stems.

    Im guessing the shims are to run higher spring pressure on the exhaust side as a way to cut costs, since they use same springs on inlet and valve, the shims are just another way to cheaply add more pressure.
     
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  18. Jethalter

    Jethalter Active Member Premium Member

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    Whilst waiting on parts, i thought i'd touch up my completely faded needles on the gauges. Looks awesome now.
    IMG20190402220743.jpg
     
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  19. Jethalter

    Jethalter Active Member Premium Member

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    So i had a read of the across owners manual today, their break in procedure is full of LOL's.
    It is as follows :
    0-800kms - Dont exceed 7k Rpm
    800-1600kms - Dont exceed 10k Rpm
    1600kms + - Can use full throttle and go over 10k Rpm

    What a joke, they really expect you to be limited to 70km/h for the first 800k's then limited for the next 800k's to 95km/h

    After its built and warmed up, its gonna be bouncing off 17k rpm out the driveway lol
     
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  20. maelstrom

    maelstrom LiteTek Staff Member Premium Member 250cc Vendor Contributing Member

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    Ignore all that owner's manual rubbish and stick to that excellent sentence that you concluded with.
     

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