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Project The Yamaha R4 (Glacially Slow Project)

Discussion in 'Other Projects - Other Bikes (non 250's)' started by maelstrom, Dec 20, 2014.

  1. maelstrom

    maelstrom LiteTek Staff Member Premium Member 250cc Vendor Contributing Member

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    Just in case anyone ever needs to overhaul a 400 gearbox, @Linkin. Since the 2nd gear pinion is pressed on, you can press it too far, right up against the 6th gear and bind it, nasty. The float value for the 6th pinion is 0.44mm. I took that measurement before disassembling. The manual has nothing except the usual rubbish - 'Inspect the gearbox - does it have gears? Yes? Oh very well then, continue assembly.'
    FZR400_float.jpg
    This is not the Yamaha parts book, it is my spreadsheet that I make to double as a parts book/manual.
     
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    Last edited: Jun 8, 2020
  2. ruckusman

    ruckusman White Mans Magic Master Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    And are you now going to get that all dirty with motor oil?
    Really?
     
  3. maelstrom

    maelstrom LiteTek Staff Member Premium Member 250cc Vendor Contributing Member

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    I don't like Spam, I mean dirt.
     
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  4. maelstrom

    maelstrom LiteTek Staff Member Premium Member 250cc Vendor Contributing Member

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    The best laid plans of mice and men often go astray
    So it was the big day, put the cases together. Dug out the crank, shells etc. Opened the bag of main bearing shells, which I had placed individually in small plastic bags with printed labels 'Top 1' etc. Since this engine has no signs of wear at all. my plan was to just put it back together. Unfortunately it has been so long that the small plastic bags had been consumed by the Ether. When I tipped them out onto the bench the lower shells for journals 1 & 2 had made good their escape and now I have no idea which is which. Oh well, buy some new ones. No, I am not going to get some plastigauge and go down that route, and I couldn't be bothered explaining why. I am always ordering from Impex anyway and one more week is neither here nor there in this saga.
    So onto determining shell sizes. This is all in the manuals, I assume the 250 will be similar but this is for the FZR400.
    The crank journals are graded by number and those are marked on the LH web.
    JournalSize_01.jpg
    The first 6 digits represent main journals, the first one being the left most and so on. The remaining 4 are the big end journals, again L to R.



    MainJournalsCase.jpg
    The sizes for the main bearing housings in the case are marked on the back of the top crankcase half from L to R. Left most being Cyl 1 etc. Yes, they are upside down.
    So to determine which shells you need you subtract the journal number from the case number and use the size table supplied by Yamaha. I made a small spreadsheet so no errors would sneak in.
    MyMainBearings.jpg
    As you can see, I need to buy one green and one brown.
     
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    Last edited: Jun 14, 2020
  5. ruckusman

    ruckusman White Mans Magic Master Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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  6. maelstrom

    maelstrom LiteTek Staff Member Premium Member 250cc Vendor Contributing Member

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    Thanks @ruckusman, give me a moment and I will check it out.
     
  7. ruckusman

    ruckusman White Mans Magic Master Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    BTW your crank is incredibly consistent, interesting that it's the case that's got the variation which requires the different coloured shells, I would have thought it would take more work to get the crank 100% across all 6 main journals and that the case would be easy
     
  8. maelstrom

    maelstrom LiteTek Staff Member Premium Member 250cc Vendor Contributing Member

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    I think the crank would have been supported better whereas the softer case, being line bored/honed, might have more tendency to move away from the tool and the tool has more tendency to flex.

    Anyway I used this
    mic.jpg
    and I am showing 5 microns, rather than 10, between increments. I can be wrong of course. Anyone who does these things all day should know. Probably on the interweb of things somewhere.

    Anyway here is the big news, I am as stupid as a box of rocks, the shells still have residual colour on their edge, so now all matched. Anyway since new shells are available and not expensive, I will inspect all these again but this time with my loupe. Then decide whether to fit new ones anyway. I'll get some plastigauge too.
    Thanks again Glen.
     
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  9. ruckusman

    ruckusman White Mans Magic Master Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    You're very welcome - is that micrometer gentle enough to not make any indentation in the metal

    IIRC I was watching a super-duper Subaru engine being built - measured the cases, reamed the cases to size, measured the crank then popped the shells beneath a dial gauge and pressed some buttons on a calculator - no plastigauge in sight, quick easy and effective

    Perhaps the reaming to size of the cases is the potential step if the various sizes are no longer available - those size increments are amazing when you consider the accuracy they were chasing and obtaining

    I suspect that reaming the bores to size for 100% consistency is the step that Yamaha found different size shells to be a more cost effective strategy
     
  10. maelstrom

    maelstrom LiteTek Staff Member Premium Member 250cc Vendor Contributing Member

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    I knew the police would be after me for that. Don't worry, I'm not leaning on it :) That is why I said I can be wrong, don't have a ball one and too lazy to uncover my lathe and drag out the dial indicator. Anyway @gregt will know.
     
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  11. Jethalter

    Jethalter Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    That looks like the prince albert tooling, is there something you're not telling us ???
     
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  12. ruckusman

    ruckusman White Mans Magic Master Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    Getting through airport metal detectors is now a long and involved process
     
  13. maelstrom

    maelstrom LiteTek Staff Member Premium Member 250cc Vendor Contributing Member

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    I had to search to find what that meant. Silly old me don't know nuffin.
     
  14. GreyImport

    GreyImport Administrator Staff Member The Chief Contributing Member

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    Dont worry mate I had to look it up too .... I think it means our character is intact and stable :cool::D
     
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  15. Jethalter

    Jethalter Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    lol, well im screwed
     
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  16. Andych

    Andych Senior Member Premium Member

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    What has the Prince of Monaco got to do with a micrometer?? :D
     
  17. kiffsta

    kiffsta Administrator Staff Member Dirty Wheel Club Contributing Member

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    I used to work with a guy who had it done , he would whip it out at every work event that served copious amounts of alcohol , he didn’t last long
     
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  18. ruckusman

    ruckusman White Mans Magic Master Premium Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    Now that's not a question that would normally appear on a work aptitude or psychological Q&A for employment
     
  19. kiffsta

    kiffsta Administrator Staff Member Dirty Wheel Club Contributing Member

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    okay, back on topic :)
     
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  20. maelstrom

    maelstrom LiteTek Staff Member Premium Member 250cc Vendor Contributing Member

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    Bit of a delay, I misplaced the new screws that hold the cam chain blade. Been driving me nuts. Found them today, silly me.
    Engine_01.jpg Engine_02.jpg
    Full set of new main shells and coated with Amsoil Assembly Lube. New starter motor bearing fitted.
    Engine_03.jpg Engine_04.jpg
    New oil sight glass, cam chain, gearbox seals and feed o-ring. Cases are assembled with Loctite 518.
    Engine_05.jpg Engine_06.jpg
    Done, crank rotates beautifully.
     
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    Last edited: Jul 4, 2020

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